Aviation

[John Trim]

http://www.aol.com/video/false-alarm...c2_lnk1|128175

Whoops British Airways plays wrong message over the ocean and people freaked out. Geez I wonder why.

I'll bet there will be some emotional distress law suits over this.

[Jerseysucks]

I'll bet there will be some emotional distress law suits over this.

Not only emotional distress but dry cleaning bills I know I would have browned or yellowed trow.

[neilmpenny]

Smoke Screening...

As you stand in endless lines this holiday season, here’s a comforting thought: all those security measures accomplish nothing, at enormous cost. That’s the conclusion of Charles C. Mann, who put the T.S.A. to the test with the help of one of America’s top security experts.

http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/fe...nsanity-201112

Absolutely brilliant article. Thanks for posting that.

[Jerseysucks]

http://news.discovery.com/space/sun-...it-120120.html

Not totally aviation related, it's more space related but it's a great article and I'm just trying to keep this board busy. Things have been a little quiet around here lately.

[Jerseysucks]

http://dailycaller.com/2012/01/23/re...-in-nashville/

TSA detains US Senator Rand Paul son of Ron Paul Presidential candidate.

[Jerseysucks]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...Unmanned_Space

The Chinese think we're spying on them with the x-37b space plane in orbit for close to 1 year.

[neilmpenny]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...Unmanned_Space

The Chinese think we're spying on them with the x-37b space plane in orbit for close to 1 year.

Ever seen the movie windtalkers? Same applies here. Interestingly there are dozens of dialects in China, so a guy from Fuchien Province in the south, who travels north to Harbin will not be able to speak to the locals. They would not understand him. However, the writing in China is pretty much the same throughout, they use pretty much the same characters.

I often wonder whether there is a CIA codebreaker out there who is devising the billion or so combinations of Chinese characters to figure out codes. Of course there are linguists out there analysing the Chinese dialects, but the country is so vast not all would be covered.

Cat and mouse lol.

The X-37b may be a colossal waste of money.

The best ever spook coup between America and China was a couple of years ago. One of those AWACS planes had problems and had to force land in southern China. They sent Chinese engineers down there, put a tent over the thing, pulled out every electronics component and stripped them down to base components. True, the crew sabotaged the equipment before landing, but the Chinese are not stupid. They learned A LOT. It goes without saying that every other system on the aircraft, as well as the airframe itself was put under the microscope (sometimes quite literally).

Every time one of those drones or stealth aircraft goes down in Iran, Iraq, Pakistan and Afghanistan, the Chinese, through back channels are all over it. You can guarantee they are now examining the rubberised compound coating from stealth aircraft to see what qualities it has. Put it through a mass spectrometer and viola! You have the recipe. Pepsi et al did this decades ago with Coke, it is only we saps who buy it that don't know what the recipe is, every one else does.

[neilmpenny]

Because of the Obama defence spending cuts, the F-35 Lightening joint strike fighter is going to be delayed again.

As it sits, they are having the devil of a time with the powerplant, stealth skin and avionics.

The problem with the powerplant I think is trying to milk the modularity out of the damn thing, which is compromising it's reliability. They are trying to fabricate a 'conventional' gas turbine as well as give it VTOL capability, sea-going and desert warfare capability all using the same core engine components. You would think that it would be easier, but each type of use has it's idiosyncrasies.

The stealth skin is another problem apparently. The existing F-22 Raptor super-cruises at around mach 1.8, and it has stealth capability. Personally, I think the stealth capability of the F-22 is more to do with it's 'wild weasel' (radar jamming) capability than the stealth capability of the airframe. I would be guessing their problems lie in several areas. The first would be the sand-blasting effect on the skin of the aircraft, which slowly degrades the rubberised coating on the skin. I remember reading that the F-104 starfighter had to be painted regularly (the badges anyway) as the friction on the skin at mach 2+ wore of the paintwork. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to figure out why the century jets had a polished aluminium skin, paint technology had not caught up (and the friction kept them polished).

Then there is the ablative aspect. If the stealth capability is a sprayed on coating, they may be having trouble with the heat caused by the friction @ mach 1 to 2.5. The surface may be degrading by ablating under intense heat. However, with the F-35, the stealth component may in fact being built into the skin itself. This would lend you to think that the composites used for the skin may not be able to handle the heat generated in mach flight, or it may be that they just cannot get it to work. The Eurofighter has 82% composites consisting of 70% carbon fibre composites and 12% glass reinforced composites. However, no stealth capability.

I hear that there are problems with the avionics. In the F-22, they already have a fifth generation aircraft with full networking capability and the firing solution software used over multiple in-flight platforms. Quite frankly, this is the core of the system and I would have thought they had it sorted. Then again, maybe they are doing a re-design after input from the F-22.

All of this dicking around has significantly increased the cost and pushed back the delivery date. Now Obama has cut back defense spending, so both factors just mentioned will increase again. It must be remembered that it is called the joint strike fighter because there is a consortium of allied countries who are putting money to help fund it. Australia has invested billions. We originally ordered about 100 of them, but they have cut that back significantly due to rising cost.

About two years ago, the American Defense Department stated that the joint venture partners may not get the full avionics suite that the US gets. We were to get the 'lite' version. Needless to say that the Australian government went into melt-down mode and let them know about it. This is not how you treat a business partner. If you promise something, deliver it, don't suddenly downgrade spec half way through production. I don't think we will be doing any more JV's with the US Defense Force.

We should have bought the Eurofighter.

Interestingly, the Chinese are developing a fifth generation fighter called the Chengdu J-20 and the Russians and Indians are developing the Sukhoi PAK FA. They may get them before we do!

[Jerseysucks]

If they're having so much trouble with the F35 they need to get their rear ends back to Area 51 and put the reverse engineering of all those UFO's into high gear.

[Jerseysucks]

http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2012/...rm-in-7-years/

Airlines reroute flights that go over the North Pole

[Barbossa]

The dad of one of my son's Little League teammates is a Marine F-18 Squadron commander at Miramar MCAS. He's pissed that the money the Marines could have used to buy Super Hornets was instead sunk into F-35 vaporware.

[Jerseysucks]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/25/alaska-airlines-retiring-_0_n_1231779.html?ir=Religion&icid=maing-grid7|main5|dl1|sec3_lnk1%26pLid%3D130282

No more wing and a prayer for Alaskan Airlines. They stopped handing out prayer cards.

[Barbossa]

They probably stopped handing out meals as well. I've flown Alaska but don't remember the cards.

In-n-Out Burger puts biblical references in the bottom of their cups. I don't mind 'cause they're food is sooo good.

[Town Without Pity]

I'm not sure where I should post this, so I'll try here as I saw no place else to go, if I'm in the wrong place pinch me and I'll delete and keep on looking.

My Dad was on a plane coming from Calif. to Seattle in the late 70's or early 80s and it was hi-jacked. With my Dad's help with a few other passengers and the flight crew they turned the plane around and landed I believe in San Fran possible. The took the hi-jacker off the plane, so no cuba trip for you. They put all the passengers back on the plane and said Open Bar and then they landed at Sea-Tac airport. My dad in polyester and a wild silk flowered shirt got off the plane laughing with both his arms around the stewardess. Of course, it was a open bar! I know we saved the newspaper but with all my moves I can't find it and I can't find anything anywhere as I don't know exactly where he originally took off at or the date. Anybody know where I might be able to find this information without driving up to the Seattle Times and dig. Any help would be much appreciated.

[Cynful]

I'm not sure where I should post this, so I'll try here as I saw no place else to go, if I'm in the wrong place pinch me and I'll delete and keep on looking.

My Dad was on a plane coming from Calif. to Seattle in the late 70's or early 80s and it was hi-jacked. With my Dad's help with a few other passengers and the flight crew they turned the plane around and landed I believe in San Fran possible. The took the hi-jacker off the plane, so no cuba trip for you. They put all the passengers back on the plane and said Open Bar and then they landed at Sea-Tac airport. My dad in polyester and a wild silk flowered shirt got off the plane laughing with both his arms around the stewardess. Of course, it was a open bar! I know we saved the newspaper but with all my moves I can't find it and I can't find anything anywhere as I don't know exactly where he originally took off at or the date. Anybody know where I might be able to find this information without driving up to the Seattle Times and dig. Any help would be much appreciated.

TWP....wow! That is an AMAZING story and you posted it in exactly the right place! There are several of us who post in this thread regularly- let's put our heads together and see what we can come up with! Fascinating!

[Town Without Pity]

TWP....wow! That is an AMAZING story and you posted it in exactly the right place! There are several of us who post in this thread regularly- let's put our heads together and see what we can come up with! Fascinating!

Thank you so much, I would love any info. I do know the hi-jacked was not killed. I remember what I was doin at the time we saw it on the news and meeting him at the airport with cameras and radios all over doing interviews, just can't pull the date or month out of my head. I'll be watchin and if I find any other info I'll let you know...Again, thank you so much.

[John Trim]

Thank you so much, I would love any info. I do know the hi-jacked was not killed. I remember what I was doin at the time we saw it on the news and meeting him at the airport with cameras and radios all over doing interviews, just can't pull the date or month out of my head. I'll be watchin and if I find any other info I'll let you know...Again, thank you so much.

You may have to subscribe online to a Seattle paper that was around in the 70's and see if the have old issues available online. Another way and I'm assuming you are in Washington State, your local library my have a back log of Sea/Tac newspapers that you could search through.

[John Trim]

I searched this page,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_hijackings#1970s

and could only find this listing that had details close to your post.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Flight_696

[Jerseysucks]

Sonny boy went to Phoenix last night on business. Aborted landing because of another plane on the runway. Does anybody know about it? It was Continental flight 1635. Newark to Phoenix.

[neilmpenny]

Brilliant stuff

Engineer debunks theory of flight

AN ENGINEER has debunked one of the most common myths in science - why aircraft fly.Aeroplanes fly because their wings cause the air pressure underneath to be greater than that above, lifting them into the air. For years engineers have been frustrated by a theory that wrongly explained the change in pressure.The myth is common in textbooks, and even Einstein was rumoured to have subscribed to it.

A Cambridge scientist was so fed up with it that he created a minute-long video to lay it to rest. The video, published on YouTube by Professor Holger Babinsky, seeks to explain in simple terms why the theory goes against the laws of physics.

Read more and see the video here: http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-...#ixzz1kf02RIB2

[Barbossa]

Interesting video. I had always known about the "Bernoulli Effect" which stated that air flowing over an asymmetric airfoil will cause a pressure differential on the upper and lower surfaces. I had also read that lift provided by this effect is actually pretty small. Aircraft get most of their lift by adjusting the angle-of-attack where lift is generated by moving air hitting the bottom surface of the wing. (And example of this is when you put your hand outside the window of a moving car and change its angle.)

The video in the link uses a symmetric airfoil with positive angle-of-attack. It doesn't seem like a demonstration of the Bernoulli effect.

[Cynful]

An airplane in your garage?

http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/29/opinio...tml?hpt=hp_bn9

[John Trim]

An airplane in your garage?

http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/29/opinio...tml?hpt=hp_bn9

That is kind of cool. Plus if you stay inside the 4 to 5 hundreds mile radius, like she said at the end your not stuck becgause of the weather. Bad weather comes up then you drive. Now if the could make one with VTOL you could eleminate the drive to and from the airport but still have a vehicle you could drive around when you got to were you were going.

[Cynful]

Delta flight slides off runway in Detroit...

http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/30/travel...html?hpt=hp_t3

[Cynful]

TSA discovery prompts New York bomb scare - six hours later...

http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/30/us/new...html?hpt=hp_t3

[neilmpenny]

TSA discovery prompts New York bomb scare - six hours later...

http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/30/us/new...html?hpt=hp_t3

Surely when they confiscate items they are logged? Said items are then bagged with a carbon copy of the log as an identifier no?

[Cynful]

Surely when they confiscate items they are logged? Said items are then bagged with a carbon copy of the log as an identifier no?

Probably not everything because there is SO much (water/soda/perfume, etc.), but something like THIS? Unbelievable.

[Cynful]

Infographic: The real cost of modern airliners (and what you could buy instead)...

http://www.terminalu.com/travel-blog...instead/22471/

[Cynful]

$30,000 for ultra first-class in the air...

http://money.cnn.com/video/news/2012...source=cnn_bin

[Cynful]

American Airlines plans to cut 13,000 jobs...

http://money.cnn.com/2012/02/01/news....htm?hpt=hp_t1

[TheMysterian]

Greasing The Jets With French Fry Oil

http://news.discovery.com/earth/airl...mkcpgn=rssnws1

[Jerseysucks]

http://www.myfoxny.com/dpp/news/nati...d-20120204-APX

OUCH, that's gonna leave a mark. Worker gets run over by a Boeing 787.

[lardass]

Interesting video. I had always known about the "Bernoulli Effect" which stated that air flowing over an asymmetric airfoil will cause a pressure differential on the upper and lower surfaces. I had also read that lift provided by this effect is actually pretty small. Aircraft get most of their lift by adjusting the angle-of-attack where lift is generated by moving air hitting the bottom surface of the wing. (And example of this is when you put your hand outside the window of a moving car and change its angle.)

The video in the link uses a symmetric airfoil with positive angle-of-attack. It doesn't seem like a demonstration of the Bernoulli effect.

Bernoulian Lift is still taught as the main form of lift now-a-days, though Newtonian lift (like you described) is becoming more recognized. Some people say both are happening at the same time, others say that it's just one effect whose properties are not all known. Some say there are several effects working together to appear as one.
IIRC Bernoulian is not considered to describe lift itself quite right, whereas Newtonian doesn't describe downwash properly.

[Jerseysucks]

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...02-15-07-51-16

Cleaning up space from the Swiss.

[John Trim]

demotivational-posters-parenthood.jpg

[Cynful]

B-17 Aluminum Overcast...Photo Gallery...

http://home.comcast.net/~szee1a/Al_o..._overcast.html

[John Trim]

B-17 Aluminum Overcast...Photo Gallery...

http://home.comcast.net/~szee1a/Al_o..._overcast.html

Very cool pictures. Awesome aircraft.

[Aviatrix]

So, it's the dead of winter in Oklahoma and I'm a bit depressed (we haven't received our annual supply of snow and cold). What's the best cure for this? Well of course, an airshow!! Tomorrow. Should help. I'll post pics if there's anything interesting.

[Jerseysucks]

http://www.aol.com/video/scare-in-the-air-022712/517283202/?icid=maing-grid7|main5|video-module|sec3_lnk1|138893

People get freaked out over pilots announcement. They didn't understand what he said.

[Jerseysucks]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...ncid=webmail16

Plane dumps poopie on a NY couple enjoying our warm spell. I don't see what the big deal is this happens to me on a daily basis except I don't see any planes around.

[Jerseysucks]

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2012/...space-station/

[Jerseysucks]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...=February_1950

Farewell Continental Airlines

[duchessmary]

The 787 Dreamliner is set to visit San Diego on March 13 and will be open for tours. Has anyone else heard of this? I'm dying to find out more info.

[Jerseysucks]

The 787 Dreamliner is set to visit San Diego on March 13 and will be open for tours. Has anyone else heard of this? I'm dying to find out more info.

BOEING 787 DREAMLINER March Tour Dates

For those interested, here is the schedule for Boeing’s 787 Tour throughout March. The visits are targeted towards places that are home to Boeing’s suppliers, customers, and employees. If anyone is able to go, please take a few pictures and “share with the group”!!!!!
March 1-4: Toronto, Canada
March 4: Boston, Massachusetts
March 5-7: Newark, New Jersey
March 8-9: Mexico City, Mexico
March 10-12: Phoenix, Arizona
March 13: San Diego, California
March 14-15: Long Beach, California
March 15-17: Salt Lake City, Utah

I have no life so I looked it up. Didn't even know it was on tour.

[duchessmary]

I'm totally bummed. I did some checking and the tour is only open to Boeing personnel. That BLOWS.

[Cynful]

F-35 makes first test flights with external weapons...

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...,2513385.story

[Cynful]

Penguins, flying first class, delight passengers on Delta flight (VIDEO)...

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow...160855726.html

[duchessmary]

Thanks for sharing, Cyn! I got my chuckle for the day!!!

[cindyt]

Breaking news: this morning, a plane taxied off runway at Hartsfield-Jackson airport in Atlanta. They don't know why. The good news is there were no passengers.

[Jerseysucks]

Breaking news: this morning, a plane taxied off runway at Hartsfield-Jackson airport in Atlanta. They don't know why. The good news is there were no passengers.

Thank God there were no Penguins either.