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Thread: Station Nightclub fire in West Warwick, Rhode Island 2

  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by dionyzus View Post
    Ok, Speck is talking about the new video posted by Mr. Chicken (link further up this page). Around 9:01 in that video is when Butler zooms in to the front door the second time, from out in the parking lot. At that time I see one or two heavyset gentlemen in the front door pileup who are sitting up. Everyone is trying to get out of course, but the man closest to the front appears to be pushing those in front of him to clear his way out. But obviously it was hard to get anyone unstuck from the pileup at that point.

    As for who he is, the front door pileup has been notoriously difficult to ID people. I don't think we've identified many people in it. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't keep trying!
    I thought I read somewhere either in Killer Show or in the witness statements that Tracy King was pushing people out the front door. Does that sound familiar?

  2. #152
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    I watched that video, and it looked like a heavyset white guy with dark hair and a mustache, lower left side of the doorway.

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    I have been following this thread (and the other one!) for a while...it was the reason why I signed back up to the forums! :-) Some seriously awesome contributions. I am just wondering if there is anywhere in the UK that I can buy the two books? Thanks in advance!

  4. #154
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    Hi Gingerbeer - could you go on Amazon.com? That's where I got my copies.
    The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Squishy View Post
    I watched that video, and it looked like a heavyset white guy with dark hair and a mustache, lower left side of the doorway.
    I can't figure it out from the video, but Steve Mancini, Joseph Rossi, Victor Stark, Benjamin Suffoletto, Fred Crisostomi, and Robert Young were all heavyset white guys. I'm not sure about mustaches since many of the pictures we have seen of the victims were old pictures taken years before they died and they looked totally different.

  6. #156
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    I didn't even notice until it was just pointed out. It happens so fast in the video, so hard to tell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Odd Socks View Post
    Hey guys 'n' gals

    Just wanted to pop in and show my face, as far as I can in forum-land.

    Every so often I get into this tragedy, I don't know why it hooks me like it does. I'm there again and have been working through Part 1 of this thread and wow - you found a few bits huh? Brilliant research. I'm sure I'll have something to offer once in a while but for now I'm just burrowing through info again
    Quote Originally Posted by Gingerbeer View Post
    I have been following this thread (and the other one!) for a while...it was the reason why I signed back up to the forums! :-) Some seriously awesome contributions. I am just wondering if there is anywhere in the UK that I can buy the two books? Thanks in advance!
    Welcome aboard!

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    Thank you! I shall have a look on Amazon, as I really want to get both books and have a read.

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by LLC View Post
    Welcome aboard!

    Mikehammer.tripod.com.

    Sorry I don't know how to highlight the above website but I was just reading it

    exits (another was in the kitchen) in the 60 seconds before panic set in. "A security guard brushed by me.. he ran by me.. all he said was 'excuse me', he didn't say 'Everyone out', nothing, nothing," said Scott bitterly, a 80's band fan from Portsmouth (Newport). In the video, a person, perhaps Budweiser rep Michael Cordier (who died), waves and points repeatedly towards the main exit. Of course, for someone working, after the brilliance of the pyrotechnics, it would have taken a dozen seconds to notice what was happening, and the entire time there was to escape was maybe 90 sec.- 70 seconds from when Butler's camera records the ignition to when he escapes the building. Few emerged after. The NFPA says temperature alone was untenable at 113 seconds. "There was no time. Half the staff died because they were pushing people out the door," said a woman sadly late Sunday(23rd) night in the Cowesett Inn across the street from the remnants of the bar. 4 members of the staff perished in the hellish inferno, including 2 bouncers: Tracy King, and Steve Mancini (who was also in the opening band-Fathead), and his wife Andrea- the ticket taker. FSGE Evacation animation



  10. #160
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    The tenth line from the top it says that half the staff died because they were pushing people out. My guess is that is Tracy King at 9:01 doing just that.

  11. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speck View Post
    Around 9:01 on the above download you can see a heavyset guy just inside the double doors. It looks like he is pushing people out. Whatever happened to that list someone here was compiling ID'ing people?
    I'll try to take a look at it tomorrow if I get a chance. I've been one of the ones who was working on ID'ing people, but sadly I've had RL issues that have been keeping me off the board more than I'd like. I am still working on it though...just taking longer than I planned.

    I'll have to actually look at this new vid, as the two I have on my computer are not in the best shape. dion, did you say you've uploaded this new one to the google drive?
    "I was 12 going on 13 the first time I saw a dead human being" --Stand by Me

  12. #162
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    http://warwickonline.com/stories/Mor...b_type=stories

    This is just a story about the upgrades to the school, but The Station fire was given credit for the upgrades. It is nice to see the tragedy get some positives occasionally. Some people learned.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LLC View Post
    Welcome aboard!
    Thank you! I've been catching up on all your health scares too! Glad to see you're still posting and doing well

    Gingerbeer, the books are available on Kindle, but the one everyone recommends isn't cheap. I'll treat myself soon, until then the contributions here have far more information than anywhere else I've ever come across in book or online.

  14. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odd Socks View Post
    Thank you! I've been catching up on all your health scares too! Glad to see you're still posting and doing well

    Gingerbeer, the books are available on Kindle, but the one everyone recommends isn't cheap. I'll treat myself soon, until then the contributions here have far more information than anywhere else I've ever come across in book or online.
    Not to take anything out of the pocket of the author of Killer Show but all the information in his book are in this thread. But it is very fragmented. I only say that because of the cost of the book. I really wish he'd lower it. You are also not allowed to loan it on Kindle or I would have passed mine to someone. Killer show is a great reference book, but I don't want anyone to feel as if they are missing out on vital information.


    Another book I highly recommend is Gina Russo's From the Ashes. She is a survivor of the fire and it is a cheaper book if you are hungry for info until you can buy Killer. She gives a personal side that you don't get from all the facts we have on this thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsonams View Post
    I'll have to actually look at this new vid, as the two I have on my computer are not in the best shape. dion, did you say you've uploaded this new one to the google drive?
    Yes, here is the direct link to the newly posted video, which shows the second front door closeup at about the 9 minute mark: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1F...it?usp=sharing

    Quote Originally Posted by SheeBee View Post
    Not to take anything out of the pocket of the author of Killer Show but all the information in his book are in this thread. But it is very fragmented. I only say that because of the cost of the book. I really wish he'd lower it. You are also not allowed to loan it on Kindle or I would have passed mine to someone. Killer show is a great reference book, but I don't want anyone to feel as if they are missing out on vital information.
    I checked out a copy of Killer Show from my local library. I would recommend people do this if cost is an issue.

  16. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by SheeBee View Post
    Not to take anything out of the pocket of the author of Killer Show but all the information in his book are in this thread. But it is very fragmented. I only say that because of the cost of the book. I really wish he'd lower it. You are also not allowed to loan it on Kindle or I would have passed mine to someone. Killer show is a great reference book, but I don't want anyone to feel as if they are missing out on vital information.
    I like to think this place actually has more accurate info.

  17. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by LLC View Post
    I like to think this place actually has more accurate info.
    Well.........we have figured out some stuff that did not appear to be correct in "Killer Show."
    The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

  18. #168
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    Killer Show is the best book out there thus far....but it leaves as many questions open as it does answer them. I hope everyone had a great summer!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by LLC View Post
    I like to think this place actually has more accurate info.
    True, I was trying to be nice. LOL

  20. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by dionyzus View Post
    Yes, here is the direct link to the newly posted video, which shows the second front door closeup at about the 9 minute mark: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1F...it?usp=sharing



    I checked out a copy of Killer Show from my local library. I would recommend people do this if cost is an issue.
    Any thoughts as to whether that is Tracy King pushing people out?

  21. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speck View Post
    Any thoughts as to whether that is Tracy King pushing people out?
    I totally think it is!
    "In a soldier's stance I aim my hand / At the mongrel dogs who teach / Fearing not I'd become my enemy / In the instant that I preach"
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    Check out my slam poetry site! (I mean, if you have a moment...) http://davidupsetrasnake.com

  22. #172
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    Every single time I watch the video of the fire starting, I find myself yelling, GET OUT, GET OUT, GET OUT, at the screen. It's just beyond horrible


    Ozzy, my boy <3 You were my snuggle buddy and I will forever remember our movie nights and warm glasses of milk.....xoxo, rest in peace my sweet boy....

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    Hello to everyone. I am new to the forum and been spending the past few days reading the thousands of posts about this awful tragedy. I don't consider (or didn't consider) myself to be a death hag, so I happened on this website because I was interested in finding people who were discussing the fire. I now realize I am a closet death hag. My name is Jen and I am a death hag.

    Seriously, I don't know that I truly understand why but this tragedy just really pulled me in for some reason. Perhaps it is like many of you have said... its victims were like many of us... they were anybody and everybody...I suppose also it is the fact that so much negligence, greed, stupidity, self centeredness contributed to make this tragedy occur and further to not provide true justice. I have been haunted by this fire for years and just recently actually watched the video tape and read the Killer Show book online. Seeing those faces on the video and knowing that many of them only have precious few seconds to live really gets to me. I want the video to end differently so much... perhaps I keep thinking somehow magically it will. It still is surreal to see these things on tape. Like 9/11 you know you are watching something awful happen... and you know objectively something awful did happen... but you can't quite accept that what you are seeing really really happened. I look at the peoples faces and can't forget their images. When I read the Killer Show... I felt so angry for their families and for them that something more serious was not done to so many of the guilty parties.

    Anyway... I just wanted to share. I know many of you feel the same and I am glad to know that I am not the only one who is obsessed with this event. I truly, swear to God, do not get "off" on watching people suffer and didn't understand why I was so fascinated by this event. I truly thought something was wrong with me because I didn't have any personal connection with this event. It makes me feel better to know that it is not just me that has felt so badly for the victims and the family and friends of the victims. The only thing I could ever even come close as using a reason for me watching is in some stupid, small way, I feel like looking away, avoiding and not dealing with the raw terror and shock is almost like denying that it occurred. Sounds bizarre but almost like the very least I can do is also be horrified and terrified by what happened...to face it and experience it...not just leave that to the family and friends of who lost someone directly. Don't know if that makes any sense.

    Oh and I also wonder too if part of it has to do with surviving a traumatic death event in my family. I survived a sibling's suicide. Just curious if other people also had a traumatic death event and if they feel it contributes to their interest (can't think of a better word) or perhaps willingness not to avoid the death issue?

    i know that details have been discussed a great deal about the event, and I just had very few observations and questions if anyone has answers:

    a) I see at least two separate fires or lines of fire on either side of the drummer immediately. To me it appears that these two fires were at least six to eight feet apart and they start on the foam part and each started independently of the other. I assumed then the two side facing Gerbs probably caused them, but just guessing. Am I correct in assuming that the foam was not also put on the ceiling? If so, anyone know why the ceilng directly above the center gerb did not appear to immediately light up? iknow this is not a crucial detail...just wondering.. Also the fact that there were two originating fires, each of which individually probably were enough to have caused the tragedy, also could impact how long people had.. though I am pretty sure the NIST experiment showed only one originating fire, not two. Maybe it doesn't matter when the orginating fires are near to each other because they merge?

    b) It appears that Scott Viera left by the stage door and his wife did not make it out because of unknown reasons...likely she was sent to the front door. Why wasn't he? Do we think he is the last person out the stage door exit since that other family had to literally push their way out? Does anyone else get the feeling that people were not let out of the stage exit door for fear that the patrons would mingle with the band? Why else would they not allow people to leave in such a clear emergency?

    c) Am I correct that the victims were never pubically identified by manner of death and location where their bodies were found? Given the condition of the building within minutes of the fire and that it took them 90 minutes to pull the last live victim out... it is possible that in pulling bodies out and putting them in body bags or what have you that they don't really know who was where? in other words the id part came later either at a morgue or some other location? I believe I read the Medical examiner REFUSED to come to the scene= that may explain why there is no graph showing where every victim was found.

    d) Given that according to NIST's report, the ambient temperature at walking level was so hot so fast, how did so many people manage to make it out? I don't understand how anyone was able, even for a split second, to stand up to run out or crawl out in 1000 degrees... or am I missing the mechanics. Maybe there were pockets of less hot "air"?

    e) Given that it was so hot, how did anyone actually die from fire vs. inhalation? In other words, I understand some victims died due to burns or secondary infections or health issues. But if you were inside and never had a chance to get out or stuck in the jam, how could you have survived the heat enough to actually die from being burned. I know this may not make sense...I am interpreting smoke inhalation as being a relatively almost instaneous thing where burning I am envisioning someone burning at a stake. bad Analogy but all I can think of.

    f) How do we know they found everyone that was there? Does anyone else think it is possible that there was a person or two...maybe a drifter...that happened to be there that was never identified because his/her remains were too small and no one knew they were there?

    g) Last thing...more like a comment. In one of the shots there is a gentleman looking straight at the camera- the awful shot where everyone is pilled up at the front door. He is in the lower left corner. he is just looking right at the camera. He looked like he was fairly well outside except for his hips and legs. I think he died but not sure. Anyway, I can't forget his face and I keep hearing "Rock Me" play off the distance. Anyone else have haunting thoughts like that?

    Thank you for letting me vacate!

    How did so many people

  24. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herpachick View Post
    Hello to everyone. I am new to the forum and been spending the past few days reading the thousands of posts about this awful tragedy. I don't consider (or didn't consider) myself to be a death hag, so I happened on this website because I was interested in finding people who were discussing the fire. I now realize I am a closet death hag. My name is Jen and I am a death hag.
    Hi Jen, nice first post! I think it's safe to say you have found a home among like-minded individuals. I'll try to address several of your questions.

    a) I see at least two separate fires or lines of fire on either side of the drummer immediately. To me it appears that these two fires were at least six to eight feet apart and they start on the foam part and each started independently of the other. I assumed then the two side facing Gerbs probably caused them, but just guessing. Am I correct in assuming that the foam was not also put on the ceiling? If so, anyone know why the ceilng directly above the center gerb did not appear to immediately light up ... though I am pretty sure the NIST experiment showed only one originating fire, not two.

    The NIST test does show two flames. The two gerbs firing at 45 degree angles are basically symmetrical, so it's no surprise that they caused twin flames on either side of the drummer alcove. As explained in Killer Show, at that angle the ridges of the foam on the walls acts to catch and collect the sparks, long enough to cause the foam to ignite. As for the ceiling, the sparks just bounce off since they can't collect the same way as on the walls. There is video of tribute band Human Clay at the Station where they have a gerb pointed straight up, and although the sparks bounce off the ceiling, they also do not ignite it.

    b) It appears that Scott Viera left by the stage door and his wife did not make it out because of unknown reasons...likely she was sent to the front door. Why wasn't he? Do we think he is the last person out the stage door exit since that other family had to literally push their way out? Does anyone else get the feeling that people were not let out of the stage exit door for fear that the patrons would mingle with the band? Why else would they not allow people to leave in such a clear emergency?

    Not sure why Kelly Viera didn't make it out (at least not under her own power, she was badly burned and later died in the hospital). She must have gotten caught in the rush of people to the front door. Regarding Scott, we have a saying here in this forum: Scott V is a prick. All kidding aside, he was on a power trip being a bouncer and we are sure that is why he was slow to recognize that people needed to leave by that door. Added to this, the club owners (the Derderians) drilled it into the staff that the stage door should never be opened during a show to cut down on noise complaints from the neighbors. So he had this foremost in mind as he turned away people from that exit, some to their deaths.

    c) Am I correct that the victims were never pubically identified by manner of death and location where their bodies were found

    According to Killer Show, the medical examiner on site started to note bodies by location but this was quickly abandoned, due to the cold and raw conditions outside combined with the massive scale of lives lost. We have tried to surmise locations of some victims, and we know a few. For example, we know Bridget Sanetti died in the ladies room, and Ty Longley was likely found either on the dance floor or the atrium.

    d) Given that according to NIST's report, the ambient temperature at walking level was so hot so fast, how did so many people manage to make it out? I don't understand how anyone was able, even for a split second, to stand up to run out or crawl out in 1000 degrees... or am I missing the mechanics. Maybe there were pockets of less hot "air"?

    I am amazed by this too. I think survival instinct just kicked in for these survivors. Also, it appears that many who were in the building for several minutes before making it out were on the floor, and crawled their way out through a window. The temperature was definitely less beneath the smoke layer.

    e) Given that it was so hot, how did anyone actually die from fire vs. inhalation? In other words, I understand some victims died due to burns or secondary infections or health issues. But if you were inside and never had a chance to get out or stuck in the jam, how could you have survived the heat enough to actually die from being burned.

    I think most of those who died by burning were trapped in the front door.

    f) How do we know they found everyone that was there? Does anyone else think it is possible that there was a person or two...maybe a drifter...that happened to be there that was never identified because his/her remains were too small and no one knew they were there?

    That's a good question, but I think most remains were substantial and easy to identify once dental records and IDs using tattoos were made.

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    Welcome to the forum, Jen!

    I'll have to go back and look for a link, but I found a reference to the fact that there is a chart that describes where each victim's body was recovered after the fire, but it isn't available to the public. I really don't know why it isn't since so much is already released and we know the names of the victims. I've been looking for that information for years.

    I haven't found exactly what I was looking for yet, but here is a list of everyone who was inside at the time of the fire and where they escaped. The victims have "DNE" in place of the location of exit.

    https://drive.google.com/folderview?...09fMVhZMVROQUk
    Last edited by Mammy; 09-14-2014 at 01:00 PM.

  26. #176
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    Welcome Jen! Woot!

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    Dan Biechele doesn't live too far away from me.
    The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noelle1966 View Post
    Dan Biechele doesn't live too far away from me.
    I do hope he has found some peace...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mammy View Post
    Welcome to the forum, Jen!

    I'll have to go back and look for a link, but I found a reference to the fact that there is a chart that describes where each victim's body was recovered after the fire, but it isn't available to the public. I really don't know why it isn't since so much is already released and we know the names of the victims. I've been looking for that information for years.

    I haven't found exactly what I was looking for yet, but here is a list of everyone who was inside at the time of the fire and where they escaped. The victims have "DNE" in place of the location of exit.

    https://drive.google.com/folderview?...09fMVhZMVROQUk
    I believe in the witness statements it says that a number of victims were found in a big pile - that was explained by them crawling over each other attempting yo get out.

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    Hi Jen, Welcome to the forum .

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    I think that Dan wanted to move back to Florida and never think of The Station again. I am not sure what he is doing these days, but I think that he is married. He was not very old when The Station fire happened, so I hope that he does find peace. He sure has remorse.
    The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

  32. #182
    Quote Originally Posted by Noelle1966 View Post
    Dan Biechele doesn't live too far away from me.

    Dan was the most cooperative of all the witnesses and deserves the most forgiveness. His intentions were never to hurt anyone.

    He was one of the only ones during the investigation and trial who was truly repentant for what he had done.

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    You can also see in the video that Dan was the only one from the band helping.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Odd Socks View Post
    Thank you! I've been catching up on all your health scares too! Glad to see you're still posting and doing well
    Thanks, OS!

    Quote Originally Posted by ozzysmom View Post
    Every single time I watch the video of the fire starting, I find myself yelling, GET OUT, GET OUT, GET OUT, at the screen. It's just beyond horrible
    I think that every single time.

    Quote Originally Posted by jsnerch View Post
    You can also see in the video that Dan was the only one from the band helping.
    Watch his body language while he is watching that last person come away from the building, on fire, walk down the ramp. Awful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noelle1966 View Post
    I think that Dan wanted to move back to Florida and never think of The Station again. I am not sure what he is doing these days, but I think that he is married. He was not very old when The Station fire happened, so I hope that he does find peace. He sure has remorse.
    I hope that he has found peace as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by LLC;
    Watch his body language while he is watching that last person come away from the building, on fire, walk down the ramp. Awful.
    It's a mixture of total disbelief & defeat. It hits me every time I watch the video.

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    Dan just continued to take the fall for everything. There is so much pain in watching the video, but it really does stand out when Dan sees the person coming down the ramp on fire. You made a big mistake, Dan, but it certainly was not all of your fault. So many players in this sad movie.
    The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

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    @Herpachick

    I think Walter Castle may have been the last one to make it out of the building through the stage door. I think when Scott V. and the band had left through that door some people might have realised their chance

    @speck:

    Actually I don't believe that the man we see in the video at that point is Tracy King. He was wearing a black T-Shirt that night and was bald. The man in the video is wearing a leather jacket and a white T-Shirt (I guess) and he is not bald either.
    What people meant by saying that Tracy King was pushing people out of the building in my opinion was that he threw them out the Atrium windows. It was the area, where the situation got bad very quickly and many who made it out of those windows were barely concious. You can read in some statements that they don't remember how they made it out, but they must have been in that area.

    I hope the guy in the video finally made his way out Does he resemble anyone of the victims?

    @dionyzus:
    Thank you so much for sharing all the files with us

    @everybody:
    hi! I'm new here It tooks me MONTHS to read through all of this, read Killer Show and watch the video a trillion times. Just like everybody else here I was totally surprise that this thing didn't let me go over years, although I hadn't even heard of it until 2012 (I didn't live in the US back in 2003)

    nodog

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    Welcome, Nodog! We're glad to have you here!

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    Welcome nodog, and thanks! I see you are as immersed in this event as the rest of us here.

    A couple of random comments. First, in the witness statement by survivor Jonathan Petrin, he states that he "recognized Jay Silvester, a person he knew from high school at the Station on the night of the fire and later saw Silvester's name on the list of deceased victims." This comment is bizarre because the name Jay Silvester is not even on the list of people in the Station, much less on the list of deceased. Is it possible this person was missed in the victim count?

    Second, according to Killer Show, Bridget Sanetti made a 911 call from the bathroom before being overcome by smoke and perishing. I wonder if the 911 call was recorded, and if it will ever be released? Again, this is assuming it was recorded at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dionyzus View Post

    Second, according to Killer Show, Bridget Sanetti made a 911 call from the bathroom before being overcome by smoke and perishing. I wonder if the 911 call was recorded, and if it will ever be released? Again, this is assuming it was recorded at all.
    911 calls are always recorded I am pretty sure it's the law, now as to this particular call being released...after all this time I doubt it will happen. Now with that being said I wonder if the Rhode Island media had ever got access to this recording and decided not to broadcast it ?? This happened in my hometown some years back when a family of 4 were killed ( burned to death ) thanks to getting hit from behind by a drunk driver. Just before that accident a family that was staying at a Days Inn motel had walked across the street to a Sheetz ( a convenience store chain ) to get coffee and donuts. As they were in the Sheetz parking lot the drunk driver almost ran over them and immediately the mother of that family had called 911 on her cell phone to report him. While on the phone with 911 the drunk driver's pick-up truck slammed into that family so the accident was caught on tape with 911. The county sent a copy of the 911 recording to our local television station for broadcast but the station declined saying more/less that the recording was just too graphic. Last year I chatted online with a former reporter for that station. She was telling me the staff at the station heard the family being burned alive as they were screaming even though that Sheetz and the intersection where the accident had taken place was a block from each other.
    Last edited by choff; 09-22-2014 at 10:50 PM.

  41. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by choff View Post
    911 calls are always recorded I am pretty sure it's the law, now as to this particular call being released...after all this time I doubt it will happen. Now with that being said I wonder if the Rhode Island media had ever got access to this recording and decided not to broadcast it ?? This happened in my hometown some years back when a family of 4 were killed ( burned to death ) thanks to getting hit from behind by a drunk driver. Just before that accident a family that was staying at a Days Inn motel had walked across the street to a Sheetz ( a convenience store chain ) to get coffee and donuts. As they were in the Sheetz parking lot the drunk driver almost ran over them and immediately the mother of that family had called 911 on her cell phone to report him. While on the phone with 911 the drunk driver's pick-up truck slammed into that family so the accident was caught on tape with 911. The county sent a copy of the 911 recording to our local television station for broadcast but the station declined saying more/less that the recording was just too graphic. Last year I chatted online with a former reporter for that station. She was telling me the staff at the station heard the family being burned alive as they were screaming even though that Sheetz and the intersection where the accident had taken place was a block from each other.
    I agree that if Bridget's call was going to be released, it would have happened by now since the fire was eleven and a half years ago. I don't know if I could listen to it or not. I'll never forget listening to Melissa Doi and Kevin Cosgrove's 911 calls while they were trapped in the World Trade Center and I regretted listening to them. I think there are some things that don't need to be released to the public out of respect for victims and their loved ones and I think 911 calls fall in that category.

    I can't imagine witnessing and hearing something as awful as the car accident that happened in your hometown. I think that is something that would haunt a person for the rest of their life. Those poor, innocent people, burning to death seems to me like it would be the worst possible way to die. I feel bad for their loved ones who lost so many family members at the same time and in such a horrific way. I hope that drunk driver got a very harsh sentence.

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    Mammy...according to family back home the driver received a sentence of 40 years.

  43. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by choff View Post
    Mammy...according to family back home the driver received a sentence of 40 years.
    Thanks for posting what you found out. I'm surprised the driver got that many years since a lot of people get punished very little for DUI deaths, but I think it's a fair sentence and definitely deserved.

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    Unfortunately, this fire, the Stardust nightclub fire and the Circus fire have one thing in common that cost many peoples' lives. Some people noticed the flames early enough to escape, but thought it was part of the show. In the case of the Stardust, survivors reported seeing smoke on the ceiling, but didn't see the smoke as a cause to become alarmed. They thought the smoke was some of the "disco effects" of dry ice. Would it be fair to say that perhaps some of the victims of the fires I mentioned sort of shut down psychologically due to shock and fear?
    "What if the Hokey Pokey is what it's really all about?" Jimmy Buffett

  45. #195
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    The Circus fire had children involved, so I can imagine the panic of the parents and children.
    The reason a dog has so many friends is because he wags his tail instead of his tongue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanwench View Post
    Unfortunately, this fire, the Stardust nightclub fire and the Circus fire have one thing in common that cost many peoples' lives. Some people noticed the flames early enough to escape, but thought it was part of the show. In the case of the Stardust, survivors reported seeing smoke on the ceiling, but didn't see the smoke as a cause to become alarmed. They thought the smoke was some of the "disco effects" of dry ice. Would it be fair to say that perhaps some of the victims of the fires I mentioned sort of shut down psychologically due to shock and fear?
    Yes, I think that's fair to say. I also think alcohol had an impact on reaction time and people who saw the fire when it started underestimated the danger and expected someone at The Station to grab a fire extinguisher and quickly put the fire out. Nobody knew the place would be an inferno in seconds. The same thing occurred during The Beverly Hills Supper Club fire because the fire started in a part of the building that wasn't as busy and crowded and took some time to reach the Cabaret room where over a thousand people were packed. Some of the patrons seated in the Cabaret room also thought the busboy's warning to leave due to a fire was part of the stand up comedy act that was on stage at the time and even some of the people who believed him thought it was just a small kitchen fire that would be put out quickly. They didn't want to give up on their drinks, meals, or seats and many of them died sitting right at their tables. I think fear and disbelief plays a part in people's reactions in any kind of an emergency or disaster.

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    Spot on as usual, Mammy. Some children who survived the circus fire thought that the fire was part of the act. More than one adult (according to the O'Nan book,) sat there thinking that someone would put out the fire and all would be fine.
    "What if the Hokey Pokey is what it's really all about?" Jimmy Buffett

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mammy View Post
    Yes, I think that's fair to say. I also think alcohol had an impact on reaction time and people who saw the fire when it started underestimated the danger and expected someone at The Station to grab a fire extinguisher and quickly put the fire out. Nobody knew the place would be an inferno in seconds. The same thing occurred during The Beverly Hills Supper Club fire because the fire started in a part of the building that wasn't as busy and crowded and took some time to reach the Cabaret room where over a thousand people were packed. Some of the patrons seated in the Cabaret room also thought the busboy's warning to leave due to a fire was part of the stand up comedy act that was on stage at the time and even some of the people who believed him thought it was just a small kitchen fire that would be put out quickly. They didn't want to give up on their drinks, meals, or seats and many of them died sitting right at their tables. I think fear and disbelief plays a part in people's reactions in any kind of an emergency or disaster.

    A LOT of what you had said could easily apply to the 1980 MGM Hotel fire in Las Vegas as well. If memory serves once some of the guests heard about the fire they just figured that being in a huge modern building the fire must be "no big deal" and if it was a major fire it wouldn't be THAT major and besides in a city like Las Vegas the fire department will be quick to put it out ..of course I am sure some of the guests were having their own "private party" in their rooms with alcohol or who knows what else probably didn't help either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanwench View Post
    Spot on as usual, Mammy. Some children who survived the circus fire thought that the fire was part of the act. More than one adult (according to the O'Nan book,) sat there thinking that someone would put out the fire and all would be fine.
    I think it's human nature to not really understand what is going on for a few seconds until it clicks in your mind, the "I can't believe this is really happening factor." Unfortunately in The Station fire, the fire progressed so fast, those seconds were the difference between life or death. John Barylick also discussed in "Killer Show" another factor called the commitment phenomenon. People paid for their ticket, had a drink in their hand, had found a good spot to watch the show, and were reluctant to believe anything serious was happening and didn't want to lose their spot. The band was even still singing and playing for the first few seconds and nobody seemed to be doing anything different, so I can see why some people thought it could have been a part of the show. Those were seconds that a lot of the victims never got back.

    Here is a short article explaining it.

    http://blog.thephoenix.com/BLOGS/not...n-tragedy.aspx
    Last edited by Mammy; 09-27-2014 at 05:48 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mammy View Post
    I think there are some things that don't need to be released to the public out of respect for victims and their loved ones and I think 911 calls fall in that category.
    I agree with this, although I admit that I still listen to them. The hope that you hear in Joachim Phoenix's voice when the 911 operator says something like, "they all do that" and Joachim asks, "yeah?" in that tiny little voice seems like far too personal a thing for me to have in my head.
    Last edited by weirdgurl; 09-27-2014 at 08:03 PM. Reason: spelling error

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