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Thread: Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 Still Missing

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    Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 Still Missing

    I was tempted to put this in the Aviation Thread, but I think it has come to the point of needing its own thread. I also did a search on Malaysia and nothing came up so I don't think a thread exists for it yet. If it does, apologies.

    A Malaysia Airlines flight carrying 239 people from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing remained missing hours after it lost contact with air traffic controllers Saturday, and a search-and-rescue effort was underway, officials said. Flight MH370, with 227 passengers and 12 crew members aboard, was scheduled to land in the Chinese capital at 6:30 a.m. but did not arrive. It departed from the Malaysian capital at 12:41 a.m. Saturday and lost contact with Malaysian air traffic controllers about two hours later, the airline said. Malaysia Airlines identified the pilot of the Boeing 777-200 as Capt. Zaharie Ahmad Shah, 53, who joined airline in 1981.

    Officials said three Americans were on the flight along with passengers from China, Malaysia, Indonesia, Australia, France, New Zealand, Ukraine, Canada, Russia, Taiwan, Italy, the Netherlands and Austria. Two infants were among the passengers, the airline said. China’s official New China News Agency said 158 Chinese nationals were on board the flight, which apparently disappeared before entering Chinese airspace. The agency said the pilots had not been in touch with Chinese air traffic control. The Civil Aviation Administration of Vietnam said the plane had failed to check in as scheduled while it was flying over the sea between Malaysia and Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam.

    The “focus of the airline is to work with the emergency responders and authorities and mobilize its full support,” the airline said in a statement on its website. “Our thoughts and prayers are with all affected passengers and crew and their family members.” “We’re closely monitoring reports on Malaysia flight MH370,” Chicago-based Boeing said on its Twitter feed. “Our thoughts are with everyone on board.” As of 11 a.m. the flight status board at Beijing airport still listed the flight as “delayed,” and family members were being directed to the nearby Lido Hotel.

    Those seeking information on passengers can contact Malaysian airlines at +60-3-7884-1234.




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    I think an air plane crash has to be one of the scariest ways to go. It's pretty obvious that's what happened, since planes don't really "go missing" for any period of time if nothing is wrong. How sad.

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    Do not knock on Death's door. Ring the bell and run. He hates that.

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    Last I heard on the radio they were getting a signal they believe is from the plane coming from Vietnam. I hope by some miracle it didn't crash but it doesn't seem too likely. I hope they find it soon.


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    I wish I hadn't read the passenger list. There's an infant from the US on that flight. I hope they're found safe. This is horrible.

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    From my own travels, I know that that part of the world can have horrible turbulence. I also know that flying in and around Malaysia and Indonesia is the most frightened I've ever been, primarily because the planes are not well maintained. I boarded a Garuda Airlines plane and the outside of it was rusty. Pilots also had sloppy take-offs and landings. But my first thought tonight was that North Korea was somehow involved. I hope they find out something, because the waiting is always the hardest part. So very sad.

    Hoping they made an emergency landing and that there are survivors, but expecting the worst.
    Any day above ground is a good day.

  7. #7
    This is the first time i've ever had the chance to talk about a topic like this while there was still hope, however slim it may be. My question is, has there ever been a situation like this, a flight just goes missing, and it turn out well in the end?


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    How sad. It's like it just vanished.

    I just heard they think it crashed near the coast off Vietnam.
    Last edited by Leasie; 03-08-2014 at 03:30 AM.

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    I would never fly in this region of the world...just because the planes aren't properly maintained.
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    Wouldn't they see something though? Like some wreckage? Even if they crashed at sea there should be something? Incredibly creepy!

    Update.. An oil slick has been spotted in the ocean, it may have crashed at sea. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/09/wo...ight.html?_r=0
    Last edited by Wendy A.; 03-08-2014 at 07:57 AM.

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    CBS is reporting 2 large oil slicks in the water....A pilot on the news this morning said there is not always debris found in the water right away, where does it go?

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    It appears it did crash at sea and yes, there will be some floating wreckage. It can take awhile to locate it, remember Air France 447. This is the beginning of a long process as the focus will be on finding the Flight Data Recorders and the Cockpit Voice Recorders;these devices give of electronic signals for a minimum of 30 days to aid in their recovery. Without the data and info these provide you may not get the true cause.
    There does not appear to have been significant weather in the area and the Captain was highly experienced. Speculation is running amok but there does not appear to be a whole lot of facts out there for the moment.

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    This is sounding sadly ominous.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leasie View Post
    CBS is reporting 2 large oil slicks in the water....A pilot on the news this morning said there is not always debris found in the water right away, where does it go?
    I watched a docu titled Air Disasters on Netflix, and this crash is especially chilling to me. In one or two cases they had to hire a salvage crew to send a submersible robot down to the bottom of the ocean to find the black boxes. However, in each case there was floating debris. IDK.
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    I just heard on the BBC that two people on the flight manifest presumed dead, are in fact alive and well in KL. Their passports were stolen. So if two passengers on the plane were travelling on stolen passports, who were they and did they have anything to do with the aircraft going down? I have not passed through KLIA in quite a while, so not sure how rigorous the screening of baggage going into the hold is. They have the usual proceedures for hand-held luggage though.

    The 777 is ultra reliable and even if the aircraft loses one of those massive engines, it can still generate enough thrust to fly. Double engine failure? I don't think so. Besides, if it was the engines, they would have been maydaying their asses off all the way down, yet the Vietnamese controllers heard nothing. This thing disappeared in an instant.

    Boom?

    But why Malaysian? Malaysia is a muslim country. Yes, there is a fundamentalist element trying to steer the country to a more rigourous way or life, but to blow up an aircraft? The flight was packed with Chinese. Maybe the Chinese Uighur separatists following up on that massacre last week?

    I have flown this route and they would have been at 30,000 feet if memory serves.

    In respect to shitty maintenance here in Asia, Malaysian is one of the better airlines. They have been winning awards these past few years and been steadily working their way up the rankings.

    As for turbulance, the bad stuff happens mainly during the monsoon season, and it isn't monsoon season now. Though it can get hairy at times, the maximum turbulence in non monsoon season happens around the equator, and Vietnam is quite a way off from there.

    Those two passengers are the key.
    Last edited by neilmpenny; 03-08-2014 at 11:28 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by neilmpenny View Post
    I just heard on the BBC that two people on the flight manifest presumed dead, are in fact alive and well in KL. Their passports were stolen. So if two passengers on the plane were travelling on stolen passports, who were they and did they have anything to do with the aircraft going down? I have not passed through KLIA in quite a while, so not sure how rigorous the screening of baggage going into the hold is. They have the usual proceedures for hand-held luggage though.

    Wow! Good point! Sure makes you wonder! I hope it's not terrorism!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wendy A. View Post
    Wow! Good point! Sure makes you wonder! I hope it's not terrorism!
    I have a feeling it is, see my theory above. I added it whilst you were writing your post.

    One other thing. The South China Sea is infested with thousands of oil rigs. It has one of the highest densities of rigs on the planet. If this thing went boom, someone would have heard it.
    Last edited by neilmpenny; 03-08-2014 at 11:40 AM.
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    I heard an "Aviation Expert" (I have no idea what his actual credentials are, as he was just a talking head) say that even if both engines suddenly stalled, the plane would have continued at least 40 miles before it actually crashed. And just like Neil said above, there would have been plenty of time for Maydays to go out. The stolen passport issue is very odd.

    My questions is that assuming the plane didn't explode mid-air, is there any way to turn off everything mid-air if it were intentionally crashed by suicide pilots? Just curious, because I thought radar was such that it would still keep tracking an object even if it didn't want to be. It seems so strange these days to just drop off radar without a trace.
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    Thanks for that update, Neil. And here it is here:Mystery passengers. This does not bode well.

    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/03...ing-23-people/
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    A plane just doesn't fall out of the sky.
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    It's not looking good at all

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    Stolen passports??? Hmmmm. I'm sure video of these people with stolen passports boarding?

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    Yes the stolen passports has my attention? Were they terrorists and this was a bombing? Or were they two of the most unlucky thieves in the world? I want to see how this turns out...

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    CNN is going to air in a few minutes (and probably every half hour after) an interview they just recently did with one of the Pilots who is now missing. Just a head's up...

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    Yeah - stolen passports has to be the key; too big to be a coincidence.

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    Wonder who the two Ukranians were.
    Suck it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ichabodius View Post
    Wonder who the two Ukranians were.
    In light of what is going on in the word, that's a good question, Ich.
    Do not knock on Death's door. Ring the bell and run. He hates that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by geekygirl View Post
    I heard an "Aviation Expert" (I have no idea what his actual credentials are, as he was just a talking head) say that even if both engines suddenly stalled, the plane would have continued at least 40 miles before it actually crashed. And just like Neil said above, there would have been plenty of time for Maydays to go out. The stolen passport issue is very odd.

    My questions is that assuming the plane didn't explode mid-air, is there any way to turn off everything mid-air if it were intentionally crashed by suicide pilots? Just curious, because I thought radar was such that it would still keep tracking an object even if it didn't want to be. It seems so strange these days to just drop off radar without a trace.
    If the pilots had time, they could covertly enter a transponder (aircraft transmitter) "squawk" code a certain number which alerts ATC that there's trouble on board, specific ones for hijacking, lost comm, and emergency.

    7500 - hijacking
    7600 - lost comm
    7700 - emergency

    I found an easy way to remember these: 75, taken alive; 76, technical glitch, 77, going to heaven. Can't remember who I got this from, but this is not from me.

    BTW, Joee, the Cockpit Voice Recorder and Flight Data Recorders from AF447 were eventually found, albeit several months after the crash, confirming that the pitot tubes did freeze over. According to Neil, the area that Malaysia Airlines crashed is more shallow and less mountainous than the Atlantic where AF447 crashed.

    When I first heard about this my first thoughts were of AF447.
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    I'm aware AF447s FDR and CVR were found, after the accident report if I recall. The shocker was the crew stalled the aircraft at altitude and never recovered from the stall and crashed a perfectly good airplane. Obviously the wreckage is much more compacted if you have an intact airframe impacting vice an airplane disintegrating at 35000 feet; the aircraft that comes apart at 350 will spread wreckage over a large area. Still way early in the game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aviatrix View Post

    BTW, Joee, the Cockpit Voice Recorder and Flight Data Recorders from AF447 were eventually found, albeit several months after the crash, confirming that the pitot tubes did freeze over. According to Neil, the area that Malaysia Airlines crashed is more shallow and less mountainous than the Atlantic where AF447 crashed.
    Yes, that area around Sumatra, Borneo, Malaysian Peninsular, Vietnam and Burma is all on the continental shelf. Any further east of Vietnam/Borneo and west of Sumatra, then you are in the deep stuff. The Mindanao Trench is just off the Philippines, and that is serious deep water.

    In respect to the passports, they would have to be pretty old passports because since around the early 2000's biometric passports were introduced. You can't just swap out the photo in the front of the passport anymore.
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    Quote Originally Posted by neilmpenny View Post
    Yes, that area around Sumatra, Borneo, Malaysian Peninsular, Vietnam and Burma is all on the continental shelf. Any further east of Vietnam/Borneo and west of Sumatra, then you are in the deep stuff. The Mindanao Trench is just off the Philippines, and that is serious deep water.

    In respect to the passports, they would have to be pretty old passports because since around the early 2000's biometric passports were introduced. You can't just swap out the photo in the front of the passport anymore.
    Aren't passports supposed to be updated ever so often or is it different from country to country? That's how much I know. And if the water is more shallow in that area shouldn't debris come to the top sooner?
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    I would have thought things like luggage, seats and shoes would have surfaced immediately?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wendy A. View Post
    I would have thought things like luggage, seats and shoes would have surfaced immediately?
    Looks like it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cindyt View Post
    Aren't passports supposed to be updated ever so often or is it different from country to country? That's how much I know. And if the water is more shallow in that area shouldn't debris come to the top sooner?
    Cindy, passports must be reissued every ten years and children's passports must have a current picture. We were traveling to Canada when our daughter was ten months old and the passport pic was taken when she was 8 months old. She was rather small for her age (she was a preemie) and we had to do several takes as I was holding her, and hands of another person can not be seen in the photo as this may indicate coercion. Whatever. She couldn't even sit up on her own, but anyway. By our next trip to Canada she was 15 months old and had changed so much from her first picture that we got a state ID for her to appease passport control in Canada. No problems. Actually it was the first time she saw snow.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joee View Post
    I'm aware AF447s FDR and CVR were found, after the accident report if I recall. The shocker was the crew stalled the aircraft at altitude and never recovered from the stall and crashed a perfectly good airplane.
    I'm of the mind that "Airbus" and "perfectly good airplane" shouldn't be used in the same sentence.

    And pitot tubes did contribute to the crash, but not the entire crash.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aviatrix View Post
    Cindy, passports must be reissued every ten years and children's passports must have a current picture. We were traveling to Canada when our daughter was ten months old and the passport pic was taken when she was 8 months old. She was rather small for her age (she was a preemie) and we had to do several takes as I was holding her, and hands of another person can not be seen in the photo as this may indicate coercion. Whatever. She couldn't even sit up on her own, but anyway. By our next trip to Canada she was 15 months old and had changed so much from her first picture that we got a state ID for her to appease passport control in Canada. No problems. Actually it was the first time she saw snow.
    10 years is the standard. Italy introduced biometric passports in 2006 and Austria introduced them (with fingerprints) in 2009. So both have a couple of years to run.

    Here is something I have just read. They are extending the search area to include the Straits of Malacca. That is a 180 degree reversal of the intended flightpath. Why would they be doing that? It's on the other side of peninsula Malaysia. Very odd.

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/travel/t...-1226848860442
    Last edited by neilmpenny; 03-08-2014 at 07:25 PM.
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    They are now investigating another two suspicious passports.
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    Quote Originally Posted by neilmpenny View Post
    They are now investigating another two suspicious passports.
    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/03...ing-23-people/
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    Quote Originally Posted by cindyt View Post
    And if the water is more shallow in that area shouldn't debris come to the top sooner?
    I would certainly think so. Especially since the cushions are flotation devices and much of the plane is plastic and aluminum. Unless there was a huge explosion and fireball that burned everything up at a high altitude that vaporized everything, or scattered small pieces over a very wide area? I just don't understand how a technologically advanced aircraft can just disappear like this one did.

    It would be interesting to know what the possible trajectory of debris would be from the point where contact was lost based on the speed and weight of the aircraft plus prevailing weather conditions. I sucked at Physics in college, but I know it's possible to calculate it.
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    Mystery deepens: Missing plane may have turned off route



    http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/03...ing-23-people/
    Do not knock on Death's door. Ring the bell and run. He hates that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by geekygirl View Post
    I would certainly think so. Especially since the cushions are flotation devices and much of the plane is plastic and aluminum. Unless there was a huge explosion and fireball that burned everything up at a high altitude that vaporized everything, or scattered small pieces over a very wide area? I just don't understand how a technologically advanced aircraft can just disappear like this one did.

    It would be interesting to know what the possible trajectory of debris would be from the point where contact was lost based on the speed and weight of the aircraft plus prevailing weather conditions. I sucked at Physics in college, but I know it's possible to calculate it.
    In one of the articles I read, an expert said that if the debris is spread over tens of kilometers you can bet on an explosion. If the debris field is small then it would have broken up instead.

    Maybe they are looking in the wrong spot? Hence no debris. I wrote above about a search in the Straits of Malacca. I read that a radar plot may suggest they turned back.

    As for the oil patches on the water. It could just be a red herring. I mentioned before about the number of oil rigs out there, it could be from an accidental spillage from a rig.
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    Quote Originally Posted by neilmpenny View Post
    In one of the articles I read, an expert said that if the debris is spread over tens of kilometers you can bet on an explosion. If the debris field is small then it would have broken up instead.

    Maybe they are looking in the wrong spot? Hence no debris. I wrote above about a search in the Straits of Malacca. I read that a radar plot may suggest they turned back.

    As for the oil patches on the water. It could just be a red herring. I mentioned before about the number of oil rigs out there, it could be from an accidental spillage from a rig.
    This just gets more bizarre by the moment, especially the possibility that the plane may have turned back....it's so weird that investigators would be looking on the opposite side of the Malaysian peninsula. WTF happened to this flight and its 239 souls on board????


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    Quote Originally Posted by Cynful View Post
    This just gets more bizarre by the moment, especially the possibility that the plane may have turned back....it's so weird that investigators would be looking on the opposite side of the Malaysian peninsula. WTF happened to this flight and its 239 souls on board????
    Paucity of information and a plethora of theories.

    Every person likes a good detective story and something like this gives all the amateur sleuths out there a chance to try to piece together the puzzle. There is a lot of clever people on this board with an excellent resevour of specific knowledge.

    As to what happened, it was pretty quick and I think pretty violent.
    Last edited by neilmpenny; 03-09-2014 at 05:35 AM.
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    If they turned back, wouldn't there be radio contact with this info? Unless the plane was hijacked and the pilots or persons unknown flew the airliner into a nosedive into the sea?

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    It's sounding more and more like an act of terrorism. Strange thing, when a terrorist group does something like this, usually they can't take credit for it fast enough! I've not heard of anyone taking credit for this which is equally strange.

  47. #47
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Singapore via Thailand via Straylia
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leasie View Post
    If they turned back, wouldn't there be radio contact with this info? Unless the plane was hijacked and the pilots or persons unknown flew the airliner into a nosedive into the sea?
    Quote Originally Posted by Wendy A. View Post
    It's sounding more and more like an act of terrorism. Strange thing, when a terrorist group does something like this, usually they can't take credit for it fast enough! I've not heard of anyone taking credit for this which is equally strange.
    My wife says hijack as well. Though Wendy makes a good point that nobody has stood up and claimed responsibility.
    I am a sick puppy....woof woof!!!

    "When they start burning books, in the end, they will also burn people." - Heiner, 19th century German poet.
    http://www.pinterest.com/neilmpenny

  48. #48
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
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    Virginia
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    Quote Originally Posted by neilmpenny View Post
    My wife says hijack as well. Though Wendy makes a good point that nobody has stood up and claimed responsibility.
    neil, I agree with your wife--it's sounding more and more like someone overtook the plane. I also agree with Wendy--most extremists are very proud to brag about this type of thing. I can't imagine how families are coping right now. I have no connection to anybody on this flight and I want this plane found NOW!!

  49. #49
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    Singapore via Thailand via Straylia
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    Missing plane highlights Phuket's stolen passport trade.

    http://www.maitlandmercury.com.au/st...t-trade/?cs=12
    I am a sick puppy....woof woof!!!

    "When they start burning books, in the end, they will also burn people." - Heiner, 19th century German poet.
    http://www.pinterest.com/neilmpenny

  50. #50
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Singapore via Thailand via Straylia
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    17,699
    It seems that the authorities are revising the dodgy passports back to two only, the Italian and Austrian's.
    I am a sick puppy....woof woof!!!

    "When they start burning books, in the end, they will also burn people." - Heiner, 19th century German poet.
    http://www.pinterest.com/neilmpenny

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