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Thread: Clutter Family Murders

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    Clutter Family Murders

    If this has already been addressed, forgive me. I'm a lazy bitch and didn't take the time to look. In November, 1959, Herbert Clutter, his wife Bonnie, son Kenyon and daughter Nancy were killed by two intruders who entered the home via an unlocked door.
    The story was documented in Truman Capote's In Cold Blood. I'm wondering if other death hags have seen the crime scene pics somewhere online and if any further resources are available.

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    I have seen the photos somewhere, I just don't remember. True death hag that I am, I pulled my copy of "In Cold Blood" off the bookshelf. It is a hardbound version from many years ago, and alas, no crime scene photos. My bet is that people just didn't want to see crime scene photos back then, but in the meantime the world has become desensitized to such things.... so they might be included in later reprints of the book. But I don'r know this to be a fact.

    Do an image search on "clutter crime scene" and see what you get. You can also wiki "In Cold Blood" and see what the reference links are. Good luck, I hope you find them.
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    Thanks for the tips. I tried to find the pics, but had no luck. "American Justice" or another of the A&E network had a program about the murders that had very brief flashes of crime scene pics. That's where I saw them and I'd hoped, death hag that I am, that I would find more info.

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    I have also seen the pictures and can not remember where.

    I loved the movie they made. Great flick.

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    Just watching in Cold Blood was enough for me, scare the life out of me

    Member since 10/10/07

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaxxx View Post
    Just watching in Cold Blood was enough for me, scare the life out of me
    I've seen it but I don't remember it...a sheriff & Frances McDormand (love her) that's all I remember. Maybe I need to watch it again.

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    The movie was great, Robert Blake, the only role I liked him in. Such a scary story then and now. Such innocence for the family to be killed like that. Every once in a while I think about the family and what they went through.
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    With "In Cold Blood," Truman Capote's desire was to establish a new format for writing: the "nonfiction novel." As such, the inclusion of actual crime scene photos in the book might have compromised, on some level, this concept. This is just a guess, but I can't think of any other reason he would NOT have published the photos, unless perhaps the thought of it was personally distasteful to him.

    Clutter crime scene photos are very difficult to find, it seems, I did a quick search and can't find any either. If anyone does, please post a link!



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    Just read about The Clutters on crimelibrary.com.
    Cool story. Would love to see the crime scene photos one day.

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    In the recent movie, "Capote", the murders of course played a big part. The movie recreated the crime scene, maybe that's what I am thinking of.

    I can't remember where I read it, but Capote wanted to see the victims. By the time he got to town (he was in NY at the time of the murders and had to take a train to Kansas where the murders occured), the autopsies had already taken place, and the bodies were at the church in their caskets in preparation for their funeral. So Capote went to the church and was sort of creeped out by seeing all four caskets lined up in front of the alter. He then went up to one of the caskets and opened the lid because he wanted to see what the victims looked like. What he saw was the body dressed up but the entire head covered in gauze (some of the victims were shot in the head).

    Me thinks that Truman was a death hag too, don't you think?
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaRaRamona View Post
    I've seen it but I don't remember it...a sheriff & Frances McDormand (love her) that's all I remember. Maybe I need to watch it again.
    Yeah, you need to watch it again. I'm thinking you are remembering Frances McDormand in Fargo, not In Cold Blood. She would have been 10 in 1967.

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    Quote Originally Posted by geekygirl View Post
    In the recent movie, "Capote", the murders of course played a big part. The movie recreated the crime scene, maybe that's what I am thinking of.

    I can't remember where I read it, but Capote wanted to see the victims. By the time he got to town (he was in NY at the time of the murders and had to take a train to Kansas where the murders occured), the autopsies had already taken place, and the bodies were at the church in their caskets in preparation for their funeral. So Capote went to the church and was sort of creeped out by seeing all four caskets lined up in front of the alter. He then went up to one of the caskets and opened the lid because he wanted to see what the victims looked like. What he saw was the body dressed up but the entire head covered in gauze (some of the victims were shot in the head).

    Me thinks that Truman was a death hag too, don't you think?
    Truman a death hag.

    You might be on to something!

    I remember reading about him going to see the casketed bodies also.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OBX View Post
    Yeah, you need to watch it again. I'm thinking you are remembering Frances McDormand in Fargo, not In Cold Blood. She would have been 10 in 1967.

    There was also a 1996 made-for-tv remake of In Cold Blood that starred Anthony Edwards and Eric Roberts as the killers. That's the version I've seen.

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    I cant find crime scene photos by now, but this link might be interesting to some of you:

    http://www2.ljworld.com/photos/galle...acy_in_photos/

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    ohhh, the 1996 version doesn't hold a CANDLE to the original. The original was shot in the actual Clutter house, and is just so amazingly well done.

    I lived for about two years in Garden City, where the trial was held. I remember walking up the steps to the courthouse to register my car or somesuch, and thinking "This is where Dick and Perry had to walk". I drove past the house a few times, but you can't see much from the road. I did have a chance to take a few pictures when I was up in a small plane though.

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    i found this shot of a bloody boot print near Herb's death body, you can see his hand(at least).

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    I heard that the Clutter house is for sale, or perhaps it's been sold by now. The Maders have lived there for many, many years and Mrs. Mader gave a tour of the house to a photographer or someone who was making a documentary about the murders. She pointed out a reddish stain on the basement wall and indicated that it was supposedly a blood stain from Herbert Clutter's violent death.

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    I think Truman must have been a death hag --- he even went to the executions.

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    Years ago I found a genealogy of the Clutters' surviving daughters, Eveanna (who was already married and living away from the family home) and Beverley (also away, and whose upcoming wedding was being planned by her parents at the time of the murders, and took place during the mourning period a couple of months later.)

    Eveanna had a son and 2 daughters (one named for sister Nancy), and Beverley had 3 daughters. Both sets of children went on to produce 16 grandchildren at the time the genealogy was posted--- there may be more by now, not to mention great-grandchildren. Both sisters, apparently, stayed married to their original husbands. Eveanna, if still alive, will turn 72 this year, and Beverley, if still also living, will turn 69.

    Nancy would have had her 65th birthday on Jan. 2, 2008. Kenyon would have been 64 on Aug. 28. Mother Bonnie would have turned 94 on Jan. 7. Father Herbert, if he had survived unto this time, would have celebrated 97 years on May 24.
    Last edited by Linnie; 01-13-2008 at 08:23 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrea View Post
    I think Truman must have been a death hag --- he even went to the executions.

    Didn't he strike up almost a friendship as it were with one of the killers? I often wondered if he actually cared for the guy or just wanted the story.

    I wonder if going to the executions was his way of severing the relationship or just getting the end for his book.

    Good thread!

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    Thank you for the pictures. I had never seen them before.

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    Do you think the Mader family is into deathhaggery? Mrs Mader restored the living room to the way it looked during the Clutter family's life and showed the bloodstain to the photog of the site linked by leevancleef.
    I'd be afraid of ghosts in that house, personally.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny Mulhenny View Post
    Do you think the Mader family is into deathhaggery? Mrs Mader restored the living room to the way it looked during the Clutter family's life and showed the bloodstain to the photog of the site linked by leevancleef.
    I'd be afraid of ghosts in that house, personally.
    It sounds like death haggery indeed with restoring the home to the way it looked during the Clutter's life! Re Truman, I think it was Perry he befriended, and I don't know if it was to "get the scoop" or what, who knows? He sounds like one you'd never know what he's up to if you were around him.
    Last edited by Andrea; 01-13-2008 at 09:33 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leevancleef View Post
    I cant find crime scene photos by now, but this link might be interesting to some of you:

    http://www2.ljworld.com/photos/galle...acy_in_photos/
    Hey! Thanks for this link.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OBX View Post
    Yeah, you need to watch it again. I'm thinking you are remembering Frances McDormand in Fargo, not In Cold Blood. She would have been 10 in 1967.
    Ha! I was thinking of "Blood Simple." That sheriff who was always smoking lol. And Frances was the wife.

    I know Fargo too well - it's one of my favorites.

    Anyway I now must see this film.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xenaswolf View Post
    Didn't he strike up almost a friendship as it were with one of the killers? I often wondered if he actually cared for the guy or just wanted the story.

    I wonder if going to the executions was his way of severing the relationship or just getting the end for his book.

    Good thread!
    The movie shows a lot of that. Yea, he became quite close to one of the killers. I think most would agree he wanted the story.

    I dunno, Capote was a strange little guy.

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    The novel, In Cold Blood could not have been written without the close relationship that Capote and Perry Smith developed. He also formed a relationship with the other defendent, but it was the relationship with Perry that made the book the success that it was...

    "Capote" with Philip Seymour Hoffman was an excellent movie, and the newer "Infamous" with Sandra Bullock as Nell Harper was even better IMHO... Both are fictionalizations of what happened, not documentaries, but still very compelling. If "Infamous" is true, Truman was a manipulative genius who would do about anything to get the scoop -- both in his novels and in his personal life....

    I highly recommend both movies, in addition to the original "In Cold Blood"....
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    I remember someone posted a link to the Clutter house listing on another message board. The site had ALOT of pictures. Nice house.

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    Mrs. Mader commented to the journalist doing the documentary about the murders that her grandchildren refused to sleep in Nancy's former bedroom, so she turned it into a computer room. To me, the bad vibes would still be in the house and I don't think I could live there.

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    That's an excellent link. There's also the documentary in three or four parts. I have super slow dial-up, so it takes freakin' forever to watch, but it's well-made. There are also pdf and jpg files of things to read. One especially poignant interview was with Robert (Bobby) Rupp, Nancy's boyfriend at the time of her death. It was the first time he'd granted an interview. He married and has grandchildren by now. Either he or his wife makes the effort to put flowers on Nancy's grave and he lives within a mile of the former Clutter farm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xenaswolf View Post
    Didn't he strike up almost a friendship as it were with one of the killers? I often wondered if he actually cared for the guy or just wanted the story.

    I wonder if going to the executions was his way of severing the relationship or just getting the end for his book.

    Good thread!
    Yes, he did become close to Perry. In fact, rumors abound that they were having a sexual relationship and were actually in love with each other.

    They spent quite a bit of time together while Truman was researching the book. I can totally understand them becoming at least good friends if they spent that much time together. Especially for Perry, who was locked up but then had a famous author visiting on a regular basis and being the focus of his attention.
    Any day above ground is a good day.

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    Reading 'In cold blood' at night I would run down the hall to the bathroom and then run back! There are only a few really scary books out there, this is one of them!

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    Does anyone have a link to the documentary?

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    Quote Originally Posted by geekygirl View Post
    Yes, he did become close to Perry. In fact, rumors abound that they were having a sexual relationship and were actually in love with each other.

    They spent quite a bit of time together while Truman was researching the book. I can totally understand them becoming at least good friends if they spent that much time together. Especially for Perry, who was locked up but then had a famous author visiting on a regular basis and being the focus of his attention.
    I don't think they had sex. If you read the story you will know that they were well seperated, plus Truman Capote would have every man and woman he wanted to. I can't picture him in a room with guards surrounding them, and some how getting in the mood.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Queen_Death_Hag View Post
    Quickly looking over that page, I saw that Herb Clutter took out a policy on himself the night before the murders and the company paid off even though the premium wasn't deposited! That would never happen today.
    (Having worked for an insurance co, I have a special hate on for the industry.)

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    I watched the 1990s version of "In Cold Blood" on TV Saturday evening. I live on a quiet country road and it wasn't terribly difficult to get a little spooked while watching it. Unlike the Clutters, I always keep my doors locked.

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    "He was a nice man....I thought so right up to the moment I cut his throat." Perry Smith on Herb Clutter

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    Quote Originally Posted by leevancleef View Post
    I cant find crime scene photos by now, but this link might be interesting to some of you:

    http://www2.ljworld.com/photos/galle...acy_in_photos/
    Fascinating. Love the pics inside the house now; true deathhaggery, lee!
    Thank you!



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    Quote Originally Posted by suzycreamcheese View Post
    "He was a nice man....I thought so right up to the moment I cut his throat." Perry Smith on Herb Clutter
    That's the line I remember best about the whole thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alanwench View Post
    I watched the 1990s version of "In Cold Blood" on TV Saturday evening. I live on a quiet country road and it wasn't terribly difficult to get a little spooked while watching it. Unlike the Clutters, I always keep my doors locked.
    I haven't seen the newer one, but I made the mistake of watching the old one late at night and spooked myself. Just knowing the murders actually happened there... *shudder*

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    Capote fell in love with one of the killers I have decided!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Queen_Death_Hag View Post
    OK - this is completely insane, but the first thing I thought when looking over those photos is - what nice penmanship the two killers have! Most men (sorry, guys) have awful penmanship.
    For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord. Romans 8:38-39

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    He went to the trouble of buying baby food and feeding it to Perry to keep him alive during a hunger strike imposed by the killer. They were very close, but I don't know how or if the relationship was consummated.

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    I first read In Cold Blood in my early teens, and read it over and over again, my parents were appalled lol, I would then go to the library and find everything I could get my hands on looking through microfiche at old newspapers, I still google the clutter killings seeing if anything is new out there (so far I have not come across anything I have not seen, and wow, I have never seen actual death pix, if anyone has a link to those that would be gold!)..I also find it interesting that Dick and Perry are buried next to each other (their graves are on FAG) This was my FIRST death hag book!

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    Helter Skelter was my first death hag book and In Cold Blood became my second when I read it in college. Good to know I'm not the only one who googles for new info. about the Clutter murders.

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    Those pics were so good!

    I am left wondering if the current owners bought it BECAUSE of it's history.

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    its so sad to look at the yearbook photos - it says deceased under them. very sad

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    Quote Originally Posted by lisalouver View Post

    I am left wondering if the current owners bought it BECAUSE of it's history.
    I can't imagine living in a house with a history like that - might be worth a seperate thread.

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    Well, I believe these people are death hags ( the people who bought the house ) Do you know they freakin gave tours of the home and charged for it? They also are EXTREMELY close to keeping the deaths at hand it appears in articles, my vote.. they are death hags! Woot!

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